[3x06] Ariel Discussion

Discuss and rate Once Upon a Time episodes

Did you like 3x06 Ariel?

Yes
39
85%
No
1
2%
Meh
6
13%
 
Total votes: 46
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Prince Ali
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Prince Ali » Tue Nov 05, 2013 4:30 pm

One thing I saw elsewhere concerning the dresses at the Under the Sea ball: the humans are celebrating an ancient sea goddess that was known for giving mermaids the ability to walk on land (ie legs!). It's no wonder women would be prone to showing off their legs at a celebration such as that, hence the multitude of short dresses.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Aura Liuli » Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:08 pm

Prince Ali wrote:One thing I saw elsewhere concerning the dresses at the Under the Sea ball: the humans are celebrating an ancient sea goddess that was known for giving mermaids the ability to walk on land (ie legs!). It's no wonder women would be prone to showing off their legs at a celebration such as that, hence the multitude of short dresses.


good catch.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby mindygirl » Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:30 pm

Prince Ali wrote:One thing I saw elsewhere concerning the dresses at the Under the Sea ball: the humans are celebrating an ancient sea goddess that was known for giving mermaids the ability to walk on land (ie legs!). It's no wonder women would be prone to showing off their legs at a celebration such as that, hence the multitude of short dresses.


I really wish this was the reason, but I don't think it's that in-depth. Honestly, I think the show just wanted to try something different...and it flopped. HARD. I'm not opposed to a modern-spin on fairytale costumes. Plus, I also get that in a different kingdom, clothing would be different. I actually liked that they tried to show that not every kingdom in FTL would be cookie cutter, princess gowns. I just don't think they executed it well at all. For example, I think that the Evil Queen's costumes are a perfect mix of modern and traditional. The costumes at the Ball in this episode really did look like a bunch of teeny-bopper, Homecoming or Prom dresses that were bought straight off the rack at some department store. Ugh, it was bad. With the exception of Snow's dress...I actually liked that one.

As far as the rest of the episode, it just gets a "meh" from me. Frankly, Snow's secret was the only one I felt was truly "deep". Everyone's secret was purely for set-up value for future storylines, including her's I'm sure. But IMO, her secret was the only one which really put it all out there. As is evidenced by the backlash and comments over it.

Ariel was fine. Good portraying of the Disney character I thought. I still would have liked to see Holland Roden play her, but I don't have anything against Joanna Garcia Swisher. However, I found the background of Regina and Tink MUCH more interesting.

Loved the part where the real Ursula gave Regina a slight smackdown. I hope we get to see real Ursula someday. And all of Regina's fantastic lines. She seriously saves this show for me most of the time.

Oh yeah, and seriously...stop complaining about the CGI. This is a television show, not the sequel to 'The Avengers'.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby OrangeSun » Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:49 pm

Eleruen - I really have to take exception to your hating and downgrading the actors skills. So in defense of them
Lana Parrilla - By far my favorite. She has the most facial expressions and can convey more emotion in a single glance than most actors will do in a life time. And doing it in a friggin green screen which for the most part is an empty room. Regina Rules
Ginny Goodwin - She really does grasp emotion and how to convey it accross the screen.
Robert Carlyle - A very accomplished Scotish actor. Love him as Gold. He does a great Job.
Josh Dallas I just love to look at as he is so cute but he is a fine actor as well.
So is Jennifer Morrison. I do not think any of them giving up on anything.

I loved the episode. Though I'm finally glad they got Regina away from the Charmings and we get to see some magic. I enjoyed Ariel. I'm sure we will get more of her back story next week.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby RebeccaMatthews » Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:19 pm

But...but...but... I can't help it if I find the castle's looking cheesy CG. Especially when other shows present better CG and aren't on ABC, like Grimm, Sleepy Hallow and Supernatural. And the ocean really did look like a pool, at least in Harry Potter it actually looked like they were jumping into a lake.

:lol:

TBH, the castles look a lot worse than the stuff I see on a show that's produced by Showtime here in Canada. Like I said in a different thread, how hard would it be to use actual castles for the exterior shots, particularly the long ones where we see the entire castle. It might do ABC some good to reduce the season by so many episodes to make the CG better to shut people like me ( :lol: ) up about it.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Caroline » Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:43 pm

Filming in location is always better than using a green screen, but it also requires to have someone looking for a place where they can film, negotiate with the owners to see if they allow it, get permissions to film, pay certain money to the business in the area in case they can't open due to the filming, and of course you also need to pay to have insurance for the equipment and the crew, get them there, and all this with way before you need to actually film.

Besides, Canada doesn't have that many castles and considering they need different looking castles for maybe an scene or two in just a few episodes, I'd say it's just not worth it.

And you just can't compare the resources a franchise like Harry Potter had with OUAT, it's not fair. Regarding the other shows, I don't watch Grimm or Supernatural but I watch Sleepy Hollow and the show doesn't use much CGI, they use a lot of special effects (which is different from CGI) and make up.

I'm not saying that you have to like OUAT's CGI, of course it could be better, but is it worth it to complain about a technical aspect of the show that is not really relevant to the storytelling?
Last edited by Caroline on Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby mindygirl » Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:50 pm

Rebecca - Ok, I will give you that...Grimm's effects are much better, you're right. Plus, you like Arrow, so you automatically get points in my book for that ;).
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Montreat11 » Wed Nov 06, 2013 12:13 am

I have never seen any of these shows so I can't speak to comparison, but I suppose my question would be how much of it are they using and for what are they using it. OUaT uses it for full on sets, I feel like any other show that I've seen use it always does something small with it, like create a dinosaur in Central Park or a cool space ship or something that combinds both CGI and live action. I always figured that the sets looked kind of cheesy because they had to put it all together very quickly but the other CGI where they combine things like creating Ursula dosen't look half bad.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Montreat11 » Wed Nov 06, 2013 3:46 am

Also, was it just me or did it look like they redid the shadow to look a bit more like Manson?
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby eleruen » Wed Nov 06, 2013 6:16 am

OrangeSun wrote:Eleruen - I really have to take exception to your hating and downgrading the actors skills. So in defense of them
Lana Parrilla - By far my favorite. She has the most facial expressions and can convey more emotion in a single glance than most actors will do in a life time. And doing it in a friggin green screen which for the most part is an empty room. Regina Rules
Ginny Goodwin - She really does grasp emotion and how to convey it accross the screen.
Robert Carlyle - A very accomplished Scotish actor. Love him as Gold. He does a great Job.
Josh Dallas I just love to look at as he is so cute but he is a fine actor as well.
So is Jennifer Morrison. I do not think any of them giving up on anything.


If you take a look at my past posts on other threads, you will find that until now I have had nothing but a very high opinion of the acting skills of Lana Parrilla, and Robert Carlyle. Lana Parrilla in particular. Cora, Graham, the Mad Hatter, and adult Pinnochio have been great, as well. This is just one of those eps when the cast seemed tired, and it showed.

If I am unhappy with the others, that is my opinion. If other people are satisfied with other actors, that is theirs, and I respect that. We are all entitled to one! Complaining (and any sarcasm) about actors is an attack on the actors, it is not an attack on your opinions of them, so I cannot see why you would take exception to my opinion, just because I disagree with you.

Perhaps you find my opinions too much or unfair on the actors, but I could say the same thing about some other stuff that other people have posted. But I didn't, because we are all entitled to our opinions.

Caroline Wrote:
Give the guys a break about the CGI, it's really expensive and it takes a lot of time, they only have like a week or so for each episode, I'm sure they'd love to have more money and time but they do the best they can with what they have.

Someone else wrote: ''ditto''.


And there was....

Well said, Caroline :)

Some of the complaints are rather nit - picky, imo.

Nit picky? How about I use some negative adjectives to describe yours?

If I am unhappy with the CGI, again that is my opinion and I am allowed to have it. I also tend to look past the CGI and focus on the relationships, the themes, the hidden messages-these plus Lana Parrilla are the only reasons why I am still watching it. Luckily it is enough to just about sustain my interest, and sustain my want to discuss the deeper aspects of the show. But sometimes I get distracted by the CGI.

Mindy Girl wrote:

Oh yeah, and seriously...stop complaining about the CGI. This is a television show, not the sequel to 'The Avengers'.


Blue highlight mine.

Nice. Was the sarcasm really necessary? Have I, at any point, dissed your opinions?
And have I, at any point, said that I am expecting movie-quality CGI? Here or on other threads? No, I haven't. What I have compared it to, however, is other, older TV shows, on a different thread.

My opinion re: CGI is also more well-informed than most others. (Yes- I know I don't work in that specific studio), but still, my opinion is a tad more well informed. This is because I happened to married to a Creative Director whose speciality is this sort of thing. He is of the honest opinion that he could do some of the effects better, in a shorter time, ON HIS OWN WITH A LIMITED BUDGET. If he says this, then I am going to believe it. He and I have been comparing it with the CGI quality of UK TV shows from 5-10 year ago, which believe you me, have a far more limited budget compared with shows from the USA, and their effects-such as fireballs, have been much better. We don't expect all of the CGI to be great, but there are some things-such as the fireballs, tentacles-that can be improved quickly, on a limited budget by skilled designers.

Futhermore, I have mentioned on other threads that there is a solution to their problem-make less episodes, and keep the show around for longer. I won't however, mention it again. Just take it as a given that I don't like it.

Also please read my post on this episode again. You will find that I had some good things to say, as well.

I am here to express my opinion, whether positive or negative. his is the whole point of this site.It could be opinions specific episodes, theories on where the show might go, the deeper meanings in things or other things. I have contributed to most of the boards. T And I do so without attack others opinions. I don't troll.

You know, I am sick of some other people's opinions, but do I complain? No! I don't like it when other people say bad things about my favorite actors either, but I realize that everyone is entitled to their opinion. Again, to reiterate: if I complain about the show, then it is not a complaint about your opinion. I respect your opinion, whether positive or negative, whether you repeat yourself or not (and many of you do!!!).

I will complain if others are going to be less than polite about mine, though. And I would appreciate it if some people here did better at realizing what this board is for, and respecting others opinions, even if it is one you don't agree with, and it is one that seems silly to you. It is okay to disagree, but sarcasm against an actual poster (not the show, not the actors), double standards, and other methods that ridicule other people's opinions are just not acceptable.

So there we have it. I have had one almighty session at pointing out bad manners and double standards toward other posters. Hopefully this the first and last time I will need to post something like this.

(I am aware that the tone of this post isn't great-in fact, some of it sounds quite snotty. But you were disrespectful by attacking my opinions, and you have to expect an emotional, defensive response. It was unfair, for the reasons outline above. It is not my intention to troll. Dissing others opinions, is however, trolling-and this is something I have never done).
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby RebeccaMatthews » Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:57 am

Caroline wrote:Besides, Canada doesn't have that many castles and considering they need different looking castles for maybe an scene or two in just a few episodes, I'd say it's just not worth it.


Hatley Castle, right off the bat comes to mind for potential use of Rumple's castle, and it's in Victoria. And I did bring that up in a different thread. And the Fairmount Hotel Macdonald in Edmonton, AB, looks rather castle-like from the outside, just edit out the city background, and use a soundstage for interior. I get they have a limited budget per episode to work with, and the fact that Canada has few actual castle's to work with, but it would be nice to see things that don't look like they were made for a video game. Would it kill them to put a little extra work into making something look not fake.

Caroline wrote:I'm not saying that you have to like OUAT's CGI, of course it could be better, but is it worth it to complain about a technical aspect of the show that is not really relevant to the storytelling?


It's worth it to complain if, as a viewer, I find it distracting from whatever else is going on in the scene.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby eleruen » Wed Nov 06, 2013 8:28 am

RebeccaMatthews wrote: Caroline wrote:I'm not saying that you have to like OUAT's CGI, of course it could be better, but is it worth it to complain about a technical aspect of the show that is not really relevant to the storytelling?



It's worth it to complain if, as a viewer, I find it distracting from whatever else is going on in the scene.


Yes exactly.

I try so hard to focus on the both story and deeper aspects of the show, but the CGI often prevents me from focusing on the screen, let alone focus on the characters and their psychology. As such, I am no longer watching it on my TV. I am now watching it on my laptop, because the screen is smaller, and so the CGI is *less* distracting.

The people in the digital design/CGI room don't need to show me pefect imagery, but it needs to be good enough and professional enough not to make my eyes sore (yes, they were actually sore when I watched it on my TV), and I am sure with the right designer, they can touch up on some of the smaller effects. As I mentioned before, a professional in this field has told me that better results can be done in less than a week with a small budget.

I don't know anything about this castle, or the hoops they would have jump though to use it, but I am sure Disney is capable of pulling a few strings. Victorian churches and Victorian/Edwardian university buildings do well for castle scenes, as well. I assume that Canada has some of these, within Vancouver or just outside it. Also the Brits left alot of colonial and parliamentary buildings behind. And I am sure the majority of the audience would prefer newish but digital touched up buildings to a complete wall of out of focus scenery.

Perhaps using these buildings are more expensive than using the CGI, in the long term, I don't know. Maybe it is quicker to start from the beginning than digitally touch up a real building. I think I'll ask the hubby for his opinion, seeing as he is the pro, I will get back to you all on what he says.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Jennie » Wed Nov 06, 2013 1:54 pm

RebeccaMatthews wrote:But...but...but... I can't help it if I find the castle's looking cheesy CG. Especially when other shows present better CG and aren't on ABC, like Grimm, Sleepy Hallow and Supernatural. And the ocean really did look like a pool, at least in Harry Potter it actually looked like they were jumping into a lake.


You are certainly entitled to your opinions, but the three shows you mentioned use very little CGI like on the massive scale of entire sets. Most of Supernatural's special effects are practical with some CGI used to amplify it. The black smoke is probably the most comparable because it was so difficult to perfect. If you look back at season 1, the black smoke was terrible, but after 8 years it's gotten much much better.

Grimm uses CGI for the monster faces, but not much else that I've seen. I've only seen a few episodes of Sleepy Hollow so far, but the special effects seem pretty similar to Supernatural and Grimm.

Could the CGI be better? Of course! But do they have it in their time and budget to make it that much better? Probably not. We have to remember that OUAT has an ensemble cast which means it costs more just to pay the actors. If they had fewer actors and sets, they could probably spend more money on the CGI, but we don't want that either (at least I don't).

Disclaimer: This is just my opinion.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby mindygirl » Wed Nov 06, 2013 5:01 pm

eleruen - I'm fluent in sarcasm. So you'll just have to stop taking it so seriously. I can't speak for anyone else; but my post wasn't even directed at you. I'll let you in on a little secret...most of the time I don't even glance over to my right to see who is saying what unless something really gets my attention. I was just making a general statement. I feel so special that I got blue highlighting...who exactly is the troll? I think anyone would be able to see by my exchange with RebeccaMatthews that I was taking the whole discussion quite light-heartedly. Actually, this post probably makes it sound like I care about the subject 1000x more than I actually do. You wanna argue with people about the acting on the show then fine (I'll let you in on another little secret, I agree with you on that subject)...but don't drag me into the middle of it.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Spinning Folly » Wed Nov 06, 2013 5:21 pm

The CGI honestly doesn't bother me but then I like old Ray Harryhausen movies so I'm not that picky when I'm watching something I enjoy.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Caroline » Wed Nov 06, 2013 5:30 pm

Look, all I said was that yes, we know the CGI could be better, but does someone really think that the showrunners do it on purpose? that if they had a way to make it better they wouldn't take it? of course they would, but they have a budget and a deadline and there is nothing they can do about it if the network doesn't give them more money and/or time, I wasn't attacking anyone and I never said that you have to like the CGI (in fact, I said the opposite), but I also understand that there is a reason for this, sorry if I offended anyone.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Her Mayorness » Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:07 pm

Spinning Folly wrote:The CGI honestly doesn't bother me but then I like old Ray Harryhausen movies so I'm not that picky when I'm watching something I enjoy.


Exactly. I thought the interior CGI was quite ok, and the only time I noticed a slightly weaker CGI was Rumple's castle - when they zoomed in straight into Neal digging into his closet, before Roland's appearance. I thought it all looked like an older version of Tomb Raider video game.
However, since I love characters and all actors and I think highly of all their acting skills, this doesn't bother me one bit.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Prince Ali » Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:29 am

Her Mayorness wrote:However, since I love characters and all actors and I think highly of all their acting skills, this doesn't bother me one bit.


Exactly! When I'm invested in the story, I can look past these things and suspend my disbelief and truly delve into the world they've created. I understand how other people can be distracted by CGI, but it usually never bothers me personally. I'm just not sure why there's some huge debate going on about it; especially since I felt like the CGI in this ep was quite good compared to the past (remember in 1x03 when Snow "threw" some magic dust at the trolls?).

And of course, I know that they're doing the best with what they have and I appreciate that they're able to do so much. I mean, they have to create entire worlds! I honestly think they do a fantastic job with what they have, and I'm sure as time goes on it will get better.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby Grey » Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:46 am

Liked
- Regina and Rumpel scenes
- Regina choking the life out of fake Belle
- Ariel's going to SB
- Real Ursula

LuLz
- Regina: You went to a long dead octopus for advice and you're going to blame me for your problems?
- Regina: You're not going to die at anyone's hands but my own.
- Regina stumbling around after Ariel shanked her. (Ya, I'm easily amused)

Best Trollolol Moment
Regina pretending to be Ursula

Why didn't...
Regina jump into the water to get Snow and Ariel? She was just a freaking half-octopus fake Ursula.

Etc
- I liked how no one cared Ariel was played by a Latina even though she is a European character.
- The CGI is faker than Criss Angel catching a bullet, but I don't care.
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Re: [3x06] Ariel Discussion

Postby HappyEndings » Thu Nov 07, 2013 1:17 am

LuLz
- Regina: You went to a long dead octopus for advice and you're going to blame me for your problems?
- Regina: You're not going to die at anyone's hands but my own.
- Regina stumbling around after Ariel shanked her. (Ya, I'm easily amused)


What does LuLZ mean? :shrug2:
Last edited by HappyEndings on Thu Nov 07, 2013 1:24 am, edited 3 times in total.

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